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Venezuela
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Oleg Smirnov
2019-01-28 11:50:12 UTC
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Is there any information that Maduro abused terror / repression against
the regular people or his political opponents? Venezuela looks somewhat
more democratic and liberal than the Saudi Arabia, for example. Also, it
doesn't seem that the VE governance is being driven by Maduro's personal
autocratic will. He represents a political party, and the party members
seem to sincerely support the government policies. So, even if there was
a reason to talk about a someone's usurpation of power, it's not about a
single person. Meanwhile, the Atlanticist propaganda once again abuses
"dictator" image in order to primitivize the picture.

If Maduro was a dictator, then how it might happen that the right-wing
opposition constitutes the majority in their parliament? Maduro and his
party respected the result of the parliamentary election, they did not
question it. But the opposition majority in the parliament still doesn't
change the fact that Maduro won the presidential election. The opposition
willingly decided to boycot the election, and now they say the election
was not for real (just because they decided to boycot it) and are trying
to usurp the power in a non-democratic way. And the US and the American
lackeys in the world, are trying to help these non-democratic folks.

It's not good, not nice.

What's happened in Venezuela is a not so uncommon situation when diffent
branches of government are suddenly under control of different, toughly
competing parties, each of which is legitimate and has certain support
among the people. It can cause a political deadlock, if the actors are
uncompromising and / or mutually arrogant. The best [outside] advice to
all the VE parties is to stop trying to undermine each other and start
searching for a common ground. In turn, the American government's call
"to pick a side" is absolutely destructive, irresponsible, and it stands
contrary to the basics of democracy. So it shall be rejected.

The ugly American swine pursues its own partisan preferencies in the VE
case. Fuck this swine, it has no right to decide what is legitimate and
what is not for Venezuela. I am myself not a fan of the radical leftist
policies, however, I think that every nation is in uniqie conditions,
depending on which the popular majority might prefer this or that. Those
who wish the Venezuelans well, should encourage intra-national dialogue
within Venezuela rather than "picking a side". Some responsible outside
powers try to soften the Venezuela situation from such a position, while
the blunt American 'triumphalist' stance has a destructive effect.

There is no doubt that Venezuela is having a hard time. There were maybe
some mistakes in the past and some policies maybe need to be changed in
order to be less idealistic and more realistic. It should not be done by
the anti-constitutional unlawful means, - and, moreover, it shouldn't be
done in favor of the American imperialism.

It looks like the Trump's claim that the US no longer recognizes Maduro
as the Venezuela president was a kind of premature ejaculation. So far,
only one of the prominent VE officials switched sides, and the military
expressed their support to the legitimate president. It's certainly not
what the conspirators expected while planning the coup. It doesn't look
like Venezuela's going to obey the Atlanticist dictates. In turn, the
Guaido's obvious collusion with U.S. government undermines the national
sovereignty of Venezuela. He simply has revealed himself as an American
puppet.

My personal humble advice to the VE parties is: do not rely on external
patrons, try to find a compromise solution among yourselves, - otherwise,
the Atlanticist empire finds a 'solution' for you in its own favor.

American meddling, especially in the recent decades, in someone else's
affairs repeatedly tended to make bad things worse as one can easily see
with regard to many nations where the US had meddled.

If the US policymakers are persistent in their 'regime change' lust then
the next American step may be to organize weaponized groups and encorage
a militant violence, in order to create a pretext for military invasion.

Those anti-Maduro local folks that may be 'seduced' by such a scenario,
should realize that any development in this way will likely make the VE
things even more problematic than they are today.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-01-28 11:55:49 UTC
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Here are some the Atlanticist fake news with regard to Venezuela.

...

<http://tinyurl.com/ydcu8dba> cnn.com

China, Turkey and Syria have joined Russia in criticizing the United
States for recognizing .. Russia's allies have firmly rejected those
supporting 35-year-old Guaido .. Turkey, Syria and Cuba .. follow Russia ..

Syria, with its own current troubles, is not a weighty player in the world
affairs, while those others expressed their position with regard to Venezuela
*before* any Russia's statements. They did it quite independently on Russia.
Erdogan was especially outspoken when he said "Maduro brother, stand tall,
Turkey stands with you" <http://tinyurl.com/y9ewmko8> in his phone call to
Maduro. All this happened before the Russian officials expressed the Russia's
official position clearly.

So why did the CNN misrepresent it so as if all them 'followed' Russia? The
fake news producers did so because 'Russia' is a heavily sacred thing for the
American populace. So it must be 'Russia' for them, once again.

...

Next thing the Atlanticist propaganda was trying, was to misrepresent Guaido
as a very important challenger, a figure which political weight is somewhat
comparable to Maduro. This is of course not the case, and only a few outlets
pointed to the fact that it looks like the 'interim president' is in hiding
<http://tinyurl.com/ycqoyka4>. The American delusional expectation was that
after the Trump's 'recognition' of Guaido the Venezuela officials would start
switching sides en masse. It hasn't happened. But the Atlanticist fake news
machine tried, and continues to try, to misrepresent it as if there was some
great confusion and 'internal struggle' within the pro-Maduro political camp.

...

In this context, the most er.. piquant, perhaps, fake news was invented by
the creative English machinators. The Reuters issued a bold story that Russia
sends a detachment of mercenary thugs <http://tinyurl.com/y8eoldgy> in order
to protect Maduro. The English fabrication was supposed to support the
'internal struggle' narrative and produce the false idea that 'the dictator'
has become so unpopular and hated by everyone that he no longer can rely even
on his guards.

...

Lies, more lies, and even more lies. I am not 100% sure of what the outcome
of the VE situation will eventually be. However, one can say for sure that
the Atlanticist foul play with regard to Venezuela is as dirty as it was in
other crisis situations in the world in the recent decades, whether it was
about Syria or the Ukraine etc etc
M.I.Wakefield
2019-01-28 14:15:52 UTC
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Post by Oleg Smirnov
Is there any information that Maduro abused terror / repression against
the regular people or his political opponents?
Yes, lots. Google "Venezuela repression"
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Venezuela looks somewhat more democratic and liberal than the Saudi
Arabia, for example.
Everywhere looks somewhat democratic and liberal from Russia, which runs on
a "one man, one vote" system; Putin has had the vote since 2000.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Also, it doesn't seem that the VE governance is being driven by Maduro's
personal autocratic will.
Yeah, it pretty much is.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
He represents a political party, and the party members seem to sincerely
support the government policies.
Because they get food. And when inflation is projected to go from one
million per cent last year to ten million per cent this year, that's a big
deal.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
So, even if there was a reason to talk about a someone's usurpation of
power, it's not about a single person. Meanwhile, the Atlanticist
propaganda once again abuses "dictator" image in order to primitivize the
picture.
There are lots of looters of Venezuela's economy who will flee into exile
with Maduro, or share his fate if he doesn't.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-01-28 14:36:18 UTC
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Post by M.I.Wakefield
Is there any information that Maduro abused terror / repression against the
regular people or his political opponents?
Yes, lots. Google "Venezuela repression"
Detention of the violent protesters as well as those people who
plan other destructive violent activities is still not a terror
or repression. For example, the French government arrests their
domestic protesters in hundreds, in the recent weeks. It may be
called 'savage repression' by the same standards.
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Venezuela looks somewhat more democratic and liberal than the Saudi Arabia,
for example.
Everywhere looks somewhat democratic and liberal from Russia, which runs on
a "one man, one vote" system; Putin has had the vote since 2000.
Yawn.

Russia is fine, keep up your wanking.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-01-28 15:11:30 UTC
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M.I.Wankfield,
Content deleted from the point where Oleg acknowledged that he had lost the
argument.
Rudy Canoza
2019-01-28 15:34:09 UTC
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Post by M.I.Wakefield
M.I.Wankfield,
Content deleted from the point where Oleg acknowledged that he had lost the
argument.
He lost it even before he began to compose, when he pressed the "Write" button.
Greg Carr
2019-01-28 17:42:05 UTC
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Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Is there any information that Maduro abused terror / repression against the
regular people or his political opponents?
Yes, lots. Google "Venezuela repression"
Detention of the violent protesters as well as those people who
plan other destructive violent activities is still not a terror
or repression. For example, the French government arrests their
domestic protesters in hundreds, in the recent weeks. It may be
called 'savage repression' by the same standards.
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Venezuela looks somewhat more democratic and liberal than the Saudi Arabia,
for example.
Everywhere looks somewhat democratic and liberal from Russia, which runs on
a "one man, one vote" system; Putin has had the vote since 2000.
Yawn.
Russia is fine, keep up your wanking.
I would rather wank off than read RT.
A Moose in Love
2019-01-28 18:56:43 UTC
Reply
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Post by Greg Carr
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Is there any information that Maduro abused terror / repression against the
regular people or his political opponents?
Yes, lots. Google "Venezuela repression"
Detention of the violent protesters as well as those people who
plan other destructive violent activities is still not a terror
or repression. For example, the French government arrests their
domestic protesters in hundreds, in the recent weeks. It may be
called 'savage repression' by the same standards.
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Venezuela looks somewhat more democratic and liberal than the Saudi Arabia,
for example.
Everywhere looks somewhat democratic and liberal from Russia, which runs on
a "one man, one vote" system; Putin has had the vote since 2000.
Yawn.
Russia is fine, keep up your wanking.
I would rather wank off than read RT.
RT tries to come off as not being a russian propaganda machine, but they are. however they're not as bad as newsmedia like cnn which does nothing these days but hack on good ole' trump.
Greg Carr
2019-01-28 21:25:31 UTC
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Post by A Moose in Love
Post by Greg Carr
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Is there any information that Maduro abused terror / repression against the
regular people or his political opponents?
Yes, lots. Google "Venezuela repression"
Detention of the violent protesters as well as those people who
plan other destructive violent activities is still not a terror
or repression. For example, the French government arrests their
domestic protesters in hundreds, in the recent weeks. It may be
called 'savage repression' by the same standards.
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Venezuela looks somewhat more democratic and liberal than the Saudi Arabia,
for example.
Everywhere looks somewhat democratic and liberal from Russia, which runs on
a "one man, one vote" system; Putin has had the vote since 2000.
Yawn.
Russia is fine, keep up your wanking.
I would rather wank off than read RT.
RT tries to come off as not being a russian propaganda machine, but they are. however they're not as bad as newsmedia like cnn which does nothing these days but hack on good ole' trump.
Trumpenfuhrer is a liar and a crook and a racist and adulterer and his poll numbers are at an all time low since he was elected.
A Moose in Love
2019-01-28 23:10:17 UTC
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Post by Greg Carr
Post by A Moose in Love
Post by Greg Carr
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Is there any information that Maduro abused terror / repression against the
regular people or his political opponents?
Yes, lots. Google "Venezuela repression"
Detention of the violent protesters as well as those people who
plan other destructive violent activities is still not a terror
or repression. For example, the French government arrests their
domestic protesters in hundreds, in the recent weeks. It may be
called 'savage repression' by the same standards.
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Venezuela looks somewhat more democratic and liberal than the Saudi Arabia,
for example.
Everywhere looks somewhat democratic and liberal from Russia, which runs on
a "one man, one vote" system; Putin has had the vote since 2000.
Yawn.
Russia is fine, keep up your wanking.
I would rather wank off than read RT.
RT tries to come off as not being a russian propaganda machine, but they are. however they're not as bad as newsmedia like cnn which does nothing these days but hack on good ole' trump.
Trumpenfuhrer is a liar and a crook and a racist and adulterer and his poll numbers are at an all time low since he was elected.
trump would not have been my #1 choice. i liked rand paul and ben carson. i do however prefer trump over hillary.
Roy
2019-01-28 20:36:09 UTC
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Post by Greg Carr
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Is there any information that Maduro abused terror / repression against the
regular people or his political opponents?
Yes, lots. Google "Venezuela repression"
Detention of the violent protesters as well as those people who
plan other destructive violent activities is still not a terror
or repression. For example, the French government arrests their
domestic protesters in hundreds, in the recent weeks. It may be
called 'savage repression' by the same standards.
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Venezuela looks somewhat more democratic and liberal than the Saudi Arabia,
for example.
Everywhere looks somewhat democratic and liberal from Russia, which runs on
a "one man, one vote" system; Putin has had the vote since 2000.
Yawn.
Russia is fine, keep up your wanking.
I would rather wank off than read RT.
Do what you do best...as they say!!! ahahahhhaahhhaahhahaahaha
Oleg Smirnov
2019-01-28 14:32:55 UTC
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More facts about Venezuela the CNN/Fox/etc won't tell you.

<http://tinyurl.com/ybde2web> moonofalabama.org

.. The Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela is not even as messy as its
neighbors are. Despite the current problems the UN's Human Developing
Index ranks Venezuela higher than most of them. ..

...

Read the text by the above link, there're facts and references.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-01-28 15:05:12 UTC
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Post by Oleg Smirnov
More facts about Venezuela the CNN/Fox/etc won't tell you.
<http://tinyurl.com/ybde2web> moonofalabama.org
.. The Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela is not even as messy as its
neighbors are. Despite the current problems the UN's Human Developing
Index ranks Venezuela higher than most of them. ..
They should have a higher ranking: They're sitting on the world's largest
proven oil reserves, but somehow, their currency has lost 99.9999969% of its
value in less than 7 years, and children are literally starving to death.

And the statistics are always stale by a year or two, by the time the UN
includes them in the update, which could explain why more than a million and
a half Venezuelans have fled to countries that theoretically aren't as well
off as their home country.

http://hdr.undp.org/en/2018-update

Huh: I count seven former client states and SSRs (Czechia, Estonia, Poland,
Lithuania, Slovakia, Latvia, Hungary) that rank above Russia ... and that
doesn't include East Germany ... no wonder they don't want you back.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-01-28 15:23:12 UTC
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Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
More facts about Venezuela the CNN/Fox/etc won't tell you.
<http://tinyurl.com/ybde2web> moonofalabama.org
.. The Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela is not even as messy as its
neighbors are. Despite the current problems the UN's Human Developing Index
ranks Venezuela higher than most of them. ..
They should have a higher ranking: They're sitting on the world's largest
proven oil reserves, but somehow, their currency has lost 99.9999969% of its
value in less than 7 years, and children are literally starving to death.
And the statistics are always stale by a year or two, by the time the UN
includes them in the update, which could explain why more than a million and
a half Venezuelans have fled to countries that theoretically aren't as well
off as their home country.
I remember, a year or two back, the Atlanticist propaganda promoted the
very same horrors about Venezuela, also those heartbreaking pictures of
the Syrian boy, which later turned out to be a staged fabrication.

Anyway, as I wrote before, nobody denies the fact that there are certain
problems in Venezuela, but they shall not be 'solved' in the Atlanticist
'regime change' way, it was enough already.
Greg Carr
2019-01-30 14:35:52 UTC
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Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
More facts about Venezuela the CNN/Fox/etc won't tell you.
<http://tinyurl.com/ybde2web> moonofalabama.org
.. The Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela is not even as messy as its
neighbors are. Despite the current problems the UN's Human Developing Index
ranks Venezuela higher than most of them. ..
They should have a higher ranking: They're sitting on the world's largest
proven oil reserves, but somehow, their currency has lost 99.9999969% of its
value in less than 7 years, and children are literally starving to death.
And the statistics are always stale by a year or two, by the time the UN
includes them in the update, which could explain why more than a million and
a half Venezuelans have fled to countries that theoretically aren't as well
off as their home country.
I remember, a year or two back, the Atlanticist propaganda promoted the
very same horrors about Venezuela, also those heartbreaking pictures of
the Syrian boy, which later turned out to be a staged fabrication.
Anyway, as I wrote before, nobody denies the fact that there are certain
problems in Venezuela, but they shall not be 'solved' in the Atlanticist
'regime change' way, it was enough already.
Shove a bottle of Stoly up your ass and give yourself an enema you lying piece of crap.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-01-30 14:46:36 UTC
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The US government has 'blocked' some of the Venezuela's state property
abroad, which is essentially a kind of theft. Then, if they give Guaido
control over these assets, and he somehow disposes of it, then it makes
him an accomplice in the theft. In this way, the state of Venezuela has
a legal ground to sue Guaido as a criminal.

In any case, if Guaido really tries to act as a president, the state of
Venezuela likely can sue him for abuse of power, because his legitimate
paliamentarian position still doesn't give him presidential powers.

Also, take into account, the US itself is N2 (after N1 China) investor
in Venezuela, so if Trump arrests the VE assets then Venezuela just can
refuse to pay debts to the American banks in retaliation.

So far, the Venezuela case has confirmed once again that the use of the
US dollar becomes more and more toxic in the world trade, and this case
will further stimulate nations to replace USD with something else. Also
the non-nice English refusal to return the gold to the owner undermines
London as a world financial center. Hey, was it worth it?

I see in the news, Maduro now offers negotiations with the opposition,
and I believe this is the only proper and legal way to solve the crisis.
The democracy way is a negotiation, rather than a someone's 'triumph of
the will' or 'final solution', and so the Trump's immature decision to
'recognize' Guiado was a premature ejaculation, as I said before. But if
the Americans curators set up their fosterlings in Venezuela to refuse
to talk with the ruling party, then it may open a path to destruction.
Greg Carr
2019-01-30 15:26:17 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
The US government has 'blocked' some of the Venezuela's state property
abroad, which is essentially a kind of theft. Then, if they give Guaido
control over these assets, and he somehow disposes of it, then it makes
him an accomplice in the theft. In this way, the state of Venezuela has
a legal ground to sue Guaido as a criminal.
In any case, if Guaido really tries to act as a president, the state of
Venezuela likely can sue him for abuse of power, because his legitimate
paliamentarian position still doesn't give him presidential powers.
Also, take into account, the US itself is N2 (after N1 China) investor
in Venezuela, so if Trump arrests the VE assets then Venezuela just can
refuse to pay debts to the American banks in retaliation.
So far, the Venezuela case has confirmed once again that the use of the
US dollar becomes more and more toxic in the world trade, and this case
will further stimulate nations to replace USD with something else. Also
the non-nice English refusal to return the gold to the owner undermines
London as a world financial center. Hey, was it worth it?
I see in the news, Maduro now offers negotiations with the opposition,
and I believe this is the only proper and legal way to solve the crisis.
The democracy way is a negotiation, rather than a someone's 'triumph of
the will' or 'final solution', and so the Trump's immature decision to
'recognize' Guiado was a premature ejaculation, as I said before. But if
the Americans curators set up their fosterlings in Venezuela to refuse
to talk with the ruling party, then it may open a path to destruction.
So are you suggesting the ruble should replace the US dollar? LOL.
Liberals are VERMIN!
2019-01-31 06:09:05 UTC
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Maduro is the president of the new Syria.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-01-31 15:23:12 UTC
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<http://tinyurl.com/y9fqcztk> france24.com

Thousands of people took to the streets across Honduras on Sunday to
protest against the president a year after his controversial inauguration.
.. Police used tear gas against protesters rallying against conservative
President .. "There are people who have been gassed and beaten" by police ..
Demonstrators waved red and black flags and some wore red vests .. Some
chanted "GET OUT J.O.H.," before setting bonfires out of police sight.
"People need a fair government, not a dictatorship," .. we have launched a
wave of escalating protests that will end in a national strike until this
dictatorship falls." / Police hurled tear gas to break up demonstrators ..
Hernandez took office January 27, 2018 after being re-elected in a vote
called fraud ..

...

People in Honduras are living about 4 times poorer that the Venezuelans.
Nobody gives a shit, as long as their rulers are pro-Atlanticist. Judging
by the Google news, neither the CNN nor Fox reported these protests, only
France24 and BBC timidly reported it, "inter alia". And for most of you, if
it was not reported than it simply doesn't exist.

Look at this chart <http://tinyurl.com/yb86dum7>. It doesn't indicate an
'economic catastrophe' in Venezuela, the idea your minders promote. Moreover
it shows there was an especially succesful development during 2003 - 2008,
right under the strong Chaves rule, which means the indiscriminate criticism
of Chavismo as such is bogus, the real issues in Venezuela are more nuanced.

In the Ukraine, people became much poorer after the 2014 pro-Atlanticist
coup. But the EU gave them visa-free regime, that stimulates younger people
to leave the country for work elsewhere. The domestic poverty stimulates the
Ukrainian exodus both towards Europe and Russia, however their 'government'
artificially suppresses labor migration to Russia by cancelling transport
connection between the Ukraine and Russia (they have already canceled all
the passenger air flights and trains, and they create special difficulties
for those entrepreneurs who dare to offer buses). So, what they have in the
Ukraine today is essentially a colonial administration which true policy is
(under nationalist slogans) to supply Europe with their cheap labor force.
Something similar with be in Venezuela, if the US succeeds with the coup.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-01-31 16:46:27 UTC
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Post by Oleg Smirnov
Look at this chart <http://tinyurl.com/yb86dum7>. It doesn't indicate an
'economic catastrophe' in Venezuela, the idea your minders promote.
The chart ends in 2014, with a per capita GDP of $17,640.

The per capita GDP for 2017, according the the IMF World Economic Outlook,
was $6890, and for 2018, was $3,300 ... in the last six and a half years,
the Venezuelan currency has lost more than 99.99999% of its value* ...
inflation in 2018 was over one million per cent, and is projected to exceed
ten million per cent in 2019 ... if you don't think that's an "economic
catastrophe", I'd love to know what you think would be.

* - If you'd had ten million bolivars in the summer of 2012, you could have
bought $1,000,000 US ... today, that ten million bolivars is worth a little
over 3 cents.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-01-31 22:24:21 UTC
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Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Look at this chart <http://tinyurl.com/yb86dum7>. It doesn't indicate
an 'economic catastrophe' in Venezuela, the idea your minders promote.
The chart ends in 2014, with a per capita GDP of $17,640.
The per capita GDP for 2017, according the the IMF World Economic
Outlook,was $6890, and for 2018, was $3,300 ... in the last six and a
half years, the Venezuelan currency has lost more than 99.99999% of its
value* ... inflation in 2018 was over one million per cent, and is
projected to exceed ten million per cent in 2019 ... if you don't think
that's an "economic catastrophe", I'd love to know what you think would
be.
* - If you'd had ten million bolivars in the summer of 2012, you could
have bought $1,000,000 US ... today, that ten million bolivars is worth
a little over 3 cents.
Hey, Wankie, your numbers represent the GDP per capita without PPP
correction.
Inflation was a touch over 1.3 MILLION PER CENT last year, children are
literally starving to death, and the average adult lost 11 kilos in body
weight because of food shortages, and you think a "PPP correction" moves
Venezuela's situation away from "economic catastrophe"????

BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!

ROTFLMGDFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Oh, and even the Socialist Worker admits that Maduro is a fuck-up:

https://socialistworker.org/2019/01/29/where-did-venezuelas-social-crisis-come-from

So, it may be time to give up on that horse.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-01-31 22:35:59 UTC
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Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Look at this chart <http://tinyurl.com/yb86dum7>. It doesn't indicate
an 'economic catastrophe' in Venezuela, the idea your minders promote.
Inflation was a touch over 1.3 MILLION PER CENT last year, children are
literally starving to death, and the average adult lost 11 kilos in body
weight because of food shortages,
Where had you picked this stuff up?
Those anti-Maduro protesters do not look emaciated.
It's visible not only to me <http://tinyurl.com/ybbpk8z4>
Post by M.I.Wakefield
BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!
ROTFLMGDFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hysteroid.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-01-31 22:49:22 UTC
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Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Inflation was a touch over 1.3 MILLION PER CENT last year, children are
literally starving to death, and the average adult lost 11 kilos in body
weight because of food shortages,
Where had you picked this stuff up?
Google "Venezuela inflation" .... or "Venezuela starvation deaths" ... or
"Venezuela weight loss".

Also, three million Venezuelans have voted with their feet, and are now
refugees in other countries.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-01-31 23:19:48 UTC
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Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
literally starving to death, and the average adult lost 11 kilos in body
weight because of food shortages,
Where had you picked this stuff up?
Google "Venezuela inflation" .... or "Venezuela starvation deaths" ... or
"Venezuela weight loss".
There's a huge lot of garbage in the Internet.

Provide exact references.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-01-31 23:29:42 UTC
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Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Where had you picked this stuff up?
Google "Venezuela inflation" .... or "Venezuela starvation deaths" ...
or "Venezuela weight loss".
There's a huge lot of garbage in the Internet.
Provide exact references.
You've got a big crowd there at your troll farm Ollie ... do your own
fucking research.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-01 00:19:08 UTC
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Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Where had you picked this stuff up?
Google "Venezuela inflation" .... or "Venezuela starvation deaths" ...
or "Venezuela weight loss".
There's a huge lot of garbage in the Internet.
Provide exact references.
You've got a big crowd there at your troll farm Ollie ... do your own
fucking research.
I'm a private person, not a 'farm'.

I already made 'fucking research' due to the claims about the
Maduro's terror and repression and could find only allegations
made by very partisan folks.

After all the bold disinformation the Atlanticism issued with
regard to Syria and the Ukraine I've become a bit skeptical to
take on trust such claims.
Byker
2019-02-01 00:42:32 UTC
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Permalink
I already made 'fucking research' due to the claims about the Maduro's
terror and repression and could find only allegations made by very
partisan folks.
After all the bold disinformation the Atlanticism issued with regard to
Syria and the Ukraine I've become a bit skeptical to take on trust such
claims.
Spetsnaz in, gold out?:

https://belsat.eu/en/news/nordwind-airlines-mysterious-boeing-flies-from-russia-to-venezuela/

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2019/01/31/world/mystery-arrival-russia-jumbo-jet-caracas-fuels-rumors-maduro-looking-relocate-gold-reserves/

I suppose we can expect GRU "dirty tricks" any time...
Keith Willshaw
2019-02-06 17:50:57 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Byker
I suppose we can expect GRU "dirty tricks" any time...
Maybe. I would hope that the U.S. has some option up their sleeve in case
this happens. The Monroe Doctrine has to be a factor at some point, if
Russian operators show up.
The Soviets managed to sneak 43,000 troops into Cuba before the 1962
missile crisis and nobody had a clue: https://tinyurl.com/yap5ctvh
True but there are some key differences. The Venezuelan opposition has
access to the international media. In Cuba most were either in exile,
dead or in jail and those still free couldn't call the BBC using social
media or Skype.

Intel gathering in 1962 was barely different than it had been in WW1,
you had to overfly the territory and take photos.

That said thus far the US Administration has played its cards right by
playing the humanitarian role. The reality is Venezuela is imploding and
as the Russians found in 1917 and the Germans in 1918 mass starvation is
going to undermine morale in the army no matter what the Generals may
say. I sincerely doubt Putin wants to commit Russian troops to such a
political swamp.

Crossposting trimmed.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-06 21:05:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Keith Willshaw
The Soviets managed to sneak 43,000 troops into Cuba before the 1962
missile crisis and nobody had a clue: https://tinyurl.com/yap5ctvh
True but there are some key differences. The Venezuelan opposition has
access to the international media.
And the legitimate Venezuelan government is under a well-orchestrated
disinformation and psyop campaign waged by the so called 'international
media' (which is in fact the Atlanticist and pro-Atlanticist media).
Post by Keith Willshaw
In Cuba most were either in exile,
dead or in jail and those still free couldn't call the BBC using social
media or Skype.
Intel gathering in 1962 was barely different than it had been in WW1,
you had to overfly the territory and take photos.
That said thus far the US Administration has played its cards right by
playing the humanitarian role. The reality is Venezuela is imploding and
as the Russians found in 1917 and the Germans in 1918 mass starvation is
going to undermine morale in the army no matter what the Generals may
say. I sincerely doubt Putin wants to commit Russian troops to such a
political swamp.
Given the anal'yst believes in fictional 'mass starvation' - no matter
whether it's supposed to be in the Venezuelan army or among the regular
Venezuelans, - the above 'analysis' is hardly relevant.

So far the most important fact is that the American blitzkrieg plan for
unlawful coup in Venezuela has failed. The state and military officials
en masse keep loyalty to the legitimate government. It certainly differs
from what the bubbly-joke gringos in the America's White House expected.
Moreover, their clumsy intimidation and hints of military intervention
caused an increase of popular support to the government. It looks like
many Venezuelans dislike such a scenario more than they dislike Maduro.
The Chavistas need to correct their policies, and the US hostile actions
and threats give them an opportunity to work out a kind of 'new deal'.

It can go into a protracted scenario. The group of the opposition that
has put forward Guaido, has even less popular support in Venezuela than
the legitimate government, which approval rating is a bit less that the
approval rating of France's Macron. Guaido controls nothing in Venezuela.
The UN hasn't recognized Guaido. I am not sure how all this will end.
I believe Venezuela needs a national dialogue rather than polarization,
and the American desructive policy doesn't contribute to that.
Post by Keith Willshaw
Crossposting trimmed.
!!!
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-06 22:34:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
And the legitimate Venezuelan government is under a well-orchestrated
disinformation and psyop campaign waged by the so called 'international
media'
You could help fix that by ending your defence of the corrupt, incompetent,
narco-kleptocrat Maduro, and stopping your attacks on the legitimate
government.

Last summer, Maduro re-valued the currency by knocking 5 zeros off, and
setting the exchange rate at 60 bolivares for 1 US dollar ... today the
exchange rate is 2,605 bolivares for 1 US dollar.


Russia begins to doubt Maduro's ability to maintain power

"Unfortunately, time is not on Maduro's side," said Vladimir Dzhabarov,
first vice president of the international affairs committee in the upper
chamber of the Russian parliament. "In a situation of worsening economic
crisis, the state of mind in society can quickly turn against them."

https://dolartoday.com/se-quiebran-alianzas-rusia-comienza-dudar-de-la-capacidad-de-maduro-en-mantener-el-poder/
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-06 23:46:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
And the legitimate Venezuelan government is under a well-orchestrated
disinformation and psyop campaign waged by the so called 'international
media'
You could help fix that by ending your defence of the corrupt, incompetent,
narco-kleptocrat Maduro, and stopping your attacks on the legitimate
government.
Last summer, Maduro re-valued the currency by knocking 5 zeros off, and
setting the exchange rate at 60 bolivares for 1 US dollar ... today the
exchange rate is 2,605 bolivares for 1 US dollar.
Russia begins to doubt Maduro's ability to maintain power
"Unfortunately, time is not on Maduro's side," said Vladimir Dzhabarov,
first vice president of the international affairs committee in the upper
chamber of the Russian parliament. "In a situation of worsening economic
crisis, the state of mind in society can quickly turn against them."
https://dolartoday.com/se-quiebran-alianzas-rusia-comienza-dudar-de-la-capacidad-de-maduro-en-mantener-el-poder/
Hey, Wankie, why do you think the news like this would impress me?
The so called 'international media' (which is the (pro-)Atlanticist
media, which is much narrower than the non-enquoted international
media) have already managed to fabricate quite a lot of things: the
Russian mercenaries, Venezuelan army defectors asking for weapons,
the mysterious planes with tons of gols, "battle of two presidents",
mass starvation and so on. All this is a coordinated psyop campaign.
The Russian officials understand the Venezuela troubles pretty well,
which does not change the fact that the VE government is legitimate,
and the effort of unlawful coup being made by the US (and supported
by the American cock's suckers) is not nice.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-06 22:37:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
"Oleg Smirnov" wrote in message news:q3fi78$mmj$***@os.motzarella.org...

Oops! While you were distracted, North Macedonia signed the paperwork to
join NATO.

North Macedonia signs accord to join NATO amid Russian concerns

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/02/north-macedonia-signs-accord-join-nato-russian-concerns-190206172957496.html
Jonathan
2019-02-08 00:05:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by Keith Willshaw
The Soviets managed to sneak 43,000 troops into Cuba before the 1962
missile crisis and nobody had a clue: https://tinyurl.com/yap5ctvh
True but there are some key differences. The Venezuelan opposition has
access to the international media.
And the legitimate Venezuelan government is under a well-orchestrated
disinformation and psyop campaign waged by the so called 'international
media' (which is in fact the Atlanticist and pro-Atlanticist media).
Post by Keith Willshaw
In Cuba most were either in exile, dead or in jail and those still
free couldn't  call the BBC using social media or Skype.
Intel gathering in 1962 was barely different than it had been in WW1,
you had to overfly the territory and take photos.
That said thus far the US Administration has played its cards right by
playing the humanitarian role. The reality is Venezuela is imploding
and as the Russians found in 1917 and the Germans in 1918 mass
starvation is going to undermine morale in the army no matter what the
Generals may say. I sincerely doubt Putin wants to commit Russian
troops to such a political swamp.
Given the anal'yst believes in fictional 'mass starvation' - no matter
whether it's supposed to be in the Venezuelan army or among the regular
Venezuelans, - the above 'analysis' is hardly relevant.
So far the most important fact is that the American blitzkrieg plan for
unlawful coup in Venezuela has failed.
Maduro rigged the election and he's as legitimate
as Kim is in N Korea. And people now have to use
a wheelbarrow to carry their cash to the store
just to buy milk and eggs, if they can find them.

Not to mention Maduro is selling off the nation's
gold reserves to stuff cash into his cronies
pockets and overseas accounts.

All signs of a junta that's on the way out.

These charts don't lie, they spell failed state
and time for democracy to make a comeback.
Yet another Russian debt that won't get paid back.

Funny how Russia never seems to get paid back for the
weapons they sell to anti-American petty dictators.



Venezuela: All you need to know about the crisis in seven charts
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-46999668



s
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-08 00:48:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
These charts don't lie, they spell failed state and time for democracy to
make a comeback. Yet another Russian debt that won't get paid back.
Funny how Russia never seems to get paid back for the weapons they sell to
anti-American petty dictators.
Ollie is a troll farm serf; he just posts what he's told to.
Venezuela: All you need to know about the crisis in seven charts
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-46999668
Wow. 130,000 people have fled to Argentina, and Argentina's about this
close --> <-- to being a basket case itself.

And as of today, it takes 2,800 bolivars to buy one US dollar.
Byker
2019-02-09 00:01:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Funny how Russia never seems to get paid back for the weapons they sell to
anti-American petty dictators.
I wonder how much 5,000 Igla shoulder-fired SAMs set them back:


This tidbit is hardly newsworthy: https://tinyurl.com/y5ok4bhg

"In 2003 the unit cost was approximately US$60,000–80,000."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9K38_Igla

Six kilometers is hardly "long range"
Venezuela: All you need to know about the crisis in seven charts
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-46999668
Wouldn't it be a kick in the head if, after Maduro gets the boot, a few of
Guaidó's supporters give the Russians a parting shot by firing a salvo or
two at Putin's Tu-160s as they take off back to Moscow...

Keith Willshaw
2019-02-08 12:36:03 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
It can go into a protracted scenario. The group of the opposition that
has put forward Guaido, has even less popular support in Venezuela than
the legitimate government, which approval rating is a bit less that the
approval rating of France's Macron. Guaido controls nothing in Venezuela.
The UN hasn't recognized Guaido. I am not sure how all this will end.
I believe Venezuela needs a national dialogue rather than polarization,
and the American desructive policy doesn't contribute to that.
The reality remains that the present government has turned a once
prosperous nation that had a pluralistic government into a police state
from which 3 million refugees have fled to avoid starvation and have so
mismanaged the oil industry of a country with the largest proven
petroleum reserves in the world that there is a shortage of gasoline and
heating oil. In fact oil production has almost halved which is what
happens when you fire competent managers and put party members in
charge. oil production has dropped by 50% in the last 2 decades which
given that its basically the only export Venezuela has is a problem.

Given that the state controls the press and polling organisations their
claims of popular support need to be treated with extreme scepticism.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-08 19:41:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Keith Willshaw
Post by Oleg Smirnov
It can go into a protracted scenario. The group of the opposition that
has put forward Guaido, has even less popular support in Venezuela than
the legitimate government, which approval rating is a bit less that the
approval rating of France's Macron. Guaido controls nothing in Venezuela.
The UN hasn't recognized Guaido. I am not sure how all this will end.
I believe Venezuela needs a national dialogue rather than polarization,
and the American desructive policy doesn't contribute to that.
The reality remains that the present government has turned a once
prosperous nation that had a pluralistic government into a police state
from which 3 million refugees have fled to avoid starvation and have so
mismanaged the oil industry of a country with the largest proven
petroleum reserves in the world that there is a shortage of gasoline and
heating oil. In fact oil production has almost halved which is what
happens when you fire competent managers and put party members in
charge. oil production has dropped by 50% in the last 2 decades which
given that its basically the only export Venezuela has is a problem.
Once in the 1980s, Venezuela had also a great crisis, mainly due to then
conjuncture in oil market, - and they did not have a leftist government at
the time. The nation became unstable for many years. Then there were bloody
riots in 1989, and it was the time when Hugo Chavez emerged as a political
figure.

So, the very Chavismo was produced by the inability of those US-obedient
governments to deal properly with the Venezuelan national issues. One can
say that the actual issue was the fact that the Venezuelan economy was
heavily non-diversified. In deed, it relied solely on the oil production,
and so it was and is prone to crises linked to oil marked volatility.

But, in turn, the fact that their economy was so non-diversified is itself
a result of the American patronal policies, since the US policy makers were
not interested to encourage Venezuela for economic diversification, since
it'd make the nation less dependent on the American patronage. Many of the
Venezuelans likely understand this complex issue. And this is why even many
of those in Venezuela who now dislike the current government, would still
be much unhappy to 'exchange' it for an U.S.-installed puppet government.

Also, many of the Venezuelans have good memories of the successful Chavista
policies before the present day crisis. It seems to be commonly recognized
among the academics and non-politicized analysts that the Chavez' government
in the 2000s provided Venezuela with a positive development, by and large.
It's also visible in this chart <http://tinyurl.com/yb86dum7>. The national
situation was noticeably improved with regard to povetry, public education,
and other 'human development' things. And all this development happened
despite strong resistance of the anti-leftist camp within Venezuela (there
was the 2002 coup attempt where the US took part too) and also despite the
discriminatory American policies towards Venezuela, although these policies
eventually contributed to the current crisis. Now the Trump administration
seeks to perform this pathetic 'aid' show-off, but it doesn't look much
impressive against the fact that the US previous policies made a damage to
the Venezuela economy incomparably higher than the amount of the 'aid' they
now seek 'to lure' the 'silly' Venezuelans with.

The notorious claim that it was 'socialism' that have 'destroyed' the
VE economy, isn't correct, it's rather a simple slogan that seeks to replace
more complex reality with an over-simplified 'anti-socialist' idea, and to
promite the bogus concept that it all is a fault of Maduro and Chavez, and
the Chavismo policies in general.

I also think, the Chavistas made some mistakes that weren't critical while
the oil price was high. They established some idealistic regulations that
stimulated corruption, alienated 'middle class' and, maybe, made some else
abuses. Chavez was lawfully elected, and Maduro was lawfully elected, and
even if there were some mistakes in their previous policies, which need to
be corrected today, it still does not give a ground for the unlawful coup
and coercive installation of a puppet government over the sovereign nation.
The American politicians and most of those European ones who have supported
the coup attempt, manifest themselves in pretty ugly way in this case.
Post by Keith Willshaw
Given that the state controls the press and polling organisations their
claims of popular support need to be treated with extreme scepticism.
I had read about the approval ratings here <http://tinyurl.com/ycmmsx94>.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-08 20:54:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Once in the 1980s, Venezuela had also a great crisis,[...] One can say that
the actual issue was the fact that the Venezuelan economy was heavily
non-diversified. [...] But, in turn, the fact that their economy was so non
diversified is itself a result of the American patronal policies,
It might be fair to blame the US for meddling, but... it's nothing but pure
america-basing when you blame the US for the failures of the VIN-ESS-WAY-LIN
government.
since the US policy makers were not interested to encourage Venezuela for
economic diversification
Of course the US is not interested in VIN-ESS-WAY-LIN economic
diversification. What... should we be wiping their pretty little asses too?
since it'd make the nation less dependent on the American patronage.
Which is more reason to get off their lazy asses and think about their own
future. They have to be responsible for their own damn failures. Can't just
sit around blaming America for all the problems in the world. The US isn't
that powerful. Gee whiz! Most of it is smoke and mirrors.
Such a 'failures' blame is relevant within the discourse the US officials
and the American propaganda set by themselves (the feigned care of the poor
Venezuelans and the exaggeration of their incredible sufferings and misery).

Essentially, and without further ado, the US government is simply not in the
right to dictate the Venezuelans whom they must recognize as their legitimate
president and government.
Keith Willshaw
2019-02-08 21:23:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
I also think, the Chavistas made some mistakes that weren't critical
while the oil price was high. They established some idealistic
regulations that stimulated corruption, alienated 'middle class' and,
maybe, made some else abuses. Chavez was lawfully elected, and Maduro
was lawfully elected, and even if there were some mistakes in their
previous policies, which need to be corrected today, it still does not
give a ground for the unlawful coup and coercive installation of a
puppet government over the sovereign nation.
The American politicians and most of those European ones who have
supported the coup attempt, manifest themselves in pretty ugly way in
this case.
This is the classic mistake made by politicians who come to power when
oil prices are high, they assume it will always be so, sooner or later
they discover their error. Venezuela made things worse by mismanaging
the industry putting their own people in charge and firing many of the
engineers and technicians who were running it and refusing to spend
money developing new fields. They also borrowed large amounts of money
when credit was cheap and again assumed things would stay that way. They
did not of course. The result is that at a time when oil prices are down
production has halved and all the money they borrowed now has to be
serviced at high interest rates.

This is not about socialism its about incompetence and corruption.

Norway is another country that has an oil based economy, universal
health care and a comprehensive social security system and its ethos is
rooted in egalitarian ideals. The difference is that it is well
governed, has negligible corruption and has maintained its level of
investment in the oil business. The profits made when oil prices were
high were used to pay back its sovereign debt and the surplus remaining
was invested in a sovereign wealth fund that is now worth more that one
trillion dollars. The Norwegian nation oil company is one of the most
advanced and professional in the world. It has also remained a true
pluralist democracy.

Compare and contrast what each did when oil prices were high.

Venezuela - Spend Spend Spend and squirrel some of the loot away in your
Swiss bank account.
Norway - Pay off your debts and put the surplus in a safe investment in
a thoroughly audited account for when the oil prices fall as they
inevitably will.
Bret Cahill
2019-02-08 21:40:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Keith Willshaw
This is not about socialism its about incompetence and corruption.
It's about all of that.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-01 02:19:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
You've got a big crowd there at your troll farm Ollie ... do your own
fucking research.
I'm a private person, not a 'farm'.
A private person who works at a Russian troll farm, spewing Russian
propaganda to random news groups at 3 am local time, just like any random
Russian would.
DoD
2019-02-01 02:33:10 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
You've got a big crowd there at your troll farm Ollie ... do your own
fucking research.
I'm a private person, not a 'farm'.
A private person who works at a Russian troll farm, spewing Russian
propaganda to random news groups at 3 am local time, just like any random
Russian would.
I think you spew more Russian propaganda than Oleg could even think about
doing, you canadian
prick.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-01 06:33:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
You've got a big crowd there at your troll farm Ollie ... do your own
fucking research.
I'm a private person, not a 'farm'.
A private person who works at a Russian troll farm, spewing Russian
propaganda to random news groups at 3 am local time, just like any random
Russian would.
I'm not random. I'm er.. special and prominent.
It still does not change the fact that I'm here
as a private person, on my own.
Steve Canyon
2019-02-01 07:18:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
You've got a big crowd there at your troll farm Ollie ... do your own
fucking research.
I'm a private person, not a 'farm'.
A private person who works at a Russian troll farm, spewing Russian
propaganda to random news groups at 3 am local time, just like any random
Russian would.
I'm not random.
You do work at a Russian troll farm. Fuck off.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-02 00:56:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Steve Canyon
You do work at a Russian troll farm. Fuck off.
Go away, Swinie.
3 AM, and Ollie has clocked in for his shift.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-01-31 21:28:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
<http://tinyurl.com/y7qgmgcu> moonofalabama.org

The Trump administration has launched a large political project to remake
several states in Latin America. .. The plan includes regime change in
Venezuela, Nicaragua and eventually Cuba. .. The project seems to echo the
"New Middle East" plan then Secretary of State Condeleeza Rice launched in
2006. It largely failed .. but left behind severely damaged states. ..

That the U.S. is going for such a wide ranging plan in the western hemisphere
explains why Trump is pressing to end the other military projects in the
Middle East and Afghanistan.

The starting shot for the new plan, the U.S. led coup attempt in Venezuela,
is already in trouble. The U.S. selected puppet Juan Guaido had called for
demonstration in support of his coup that were supposed to take place
yesterday (OS: Jan 30). But even the NYT, which propagandizes for each and
every regime change operation the U.S. undertakes in Latin America, could
find only little evidence of support ..

The public in Venezuela is evidently not supporting the foreign induced coup
attempt. A recent poll <http://clck.ru/F8AVF> shows that more than 80% of the
people are against sanctions and other international interventions to remove
President Maduro. 80% also support talks between the government and the
opposition which Maduro repeatedly offered but which the coup plotters reject.

...

Very interesting analysis. I recommend to read it in full. I agree that the
main option the Atlanticism can use in Venezuela is to instigate a violence
in some way, similarly to the way they started their coup attempt in Syria.
Greg Carr
2019-01-31 23:34:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
<http://tinyurl.com/y7qgmgcu> moonofalabama.org
The Trump administration has launched a large political project to remake
several states in Latin America. .. The plan includes regime change in
Venezuela, Nicaragua and eventually Cuba. .. The project seems to echo the
"New Middle East" plan then Secretary of State Condeleeza Rice launched in
2006. It largely failed .. but left behind severely damaged states. ..
That the U.S. is going for such a wide ranging plan in the western hemisphere
explains why Trump is pressing to end the other military projects in the
Middle East and Afghanistan.
The starting shot for the new plan, the U.S. led coup attempt in Venezuela,
is already in trouble. The U.S. selected puppet Juan Guaido had called for
demonstration in support of his coup that were supposed to take place
yesterday (OS: Jan 30). But even the NYT, which propagandizes for each and
every regime change operation the U.S. undertakes in Latin America, could
find only little evidence of support ..
The public in Venezuela is evidently not supporting the foreign induced coup
attempt. A recent poll <http://clck.ru/F8AVF> shows that more than 80% of the
people are against sanctions and other international interventions to remove
President Maduro. 80% also support talks between the government and the
opposition which Maduro repeatedly offered but which the coup plotters reject.
...
Very interesting analysis. I recommend to read it in full. I agree that the
main option the Atlanticism can use in Venezuela is to instigate a violence
in some way, similarly to the way they started their coup attempt in Syria.
Kill Assad and all the Russians and Iranians in Syria. Israel from Gaza to the Euphrates.
A Moose in Love
2019-01-31 23:37:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Greg Carr
Post by Oleg Smirnov
<http://tinyurl.com/y7qgmgcu> moonofalabama.org
The Trump administration has launched a large political project to remake
several states in Latin America. .. The plan includes regime change in
Venezuela, Nicaragua and eventually Cuba. .. The project seems to echo the
"New Middle East" plan then Secretary of State Condeleeza Rice launched in
2006. It largely failed .. but left behind severely damaged states. ..
That the U.S. is going for such a wide ranging plan in the western hemisphere
explains why Trump is pressing to end the other military projects in the
Middle East and Afghanistan.
The starting shot for the new plan, the U.S. led coup attempt in Venezuela,
is already in trouble. The U.S. selected puppet Juan Guaido had called for
demonstration in support of his coup that were supposed to take place
yesterday (OS: Jan 30). But even the NYT, which propagandizes for each and
every regime change operation the U.S. undertakes in Latin America, could
find only little evidence of support ..
The public in Venezuela is evidently not supporting the foreign induced coup
attempt. A recent poll <http://clck.ru/F8AVF> shows that more than 80% of the
people are against sanctions and other international interventions to remove
President Maduro. 80% also support talks between the government and the
opposition which Maduro repeatedly offered but which the coup plotters reject.
...
Very interesting analysis. I recommend to read it in full. I agree that the
main option the Atlanticism can use in Venezuela is to instigate a violence
in some way, similarly to the way they started their coup attempt in Syria.
Kill Assad and all the Russians and Iranians in Syria. Israel from Gaza to the Euphrates.
those actions would start some serious shit.
PhantomView
2019-02-01 06:47:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Venezuela is going DOWN.

Expect chaos, perhaps a civil war, in the immediate future.

The communist Maduro has absolutely ruined the country.
Six-figure inflation, starvation, aggressive police-state tactics,
rigged elections, propaganda, a leftist nightmare.

Venezuela should be a lesson for any place in the world where
socialists/communists promise utopia. Same old lies, same old
results.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-01 15:45:57 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by PhantomView
Venezuela is going DOWN.
Expect chaos, perhaps a civil war, in the immediate future.
The communist Maduro has absolutely ruined the country. Six-figure
inflation, starvation, aggressive police-state tactics, rigged elections,
propaganda, a leftist nightmare.
Venezuela should be a lesson for any place in the world where
socialists/communists promise utopia. Same old lies, same old results.
It's not the socialism that did in Venezuela; it was the incompetence and
corruption.
DoD
2019-02-01 15:54:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by PhantomView
Venezuela is going DOWN.
Expect chaos, perhaps a civil war, in the immediate future.
The communist Maduro has absolutely ruined the country. Six-figure
inflation, starvation, aggressive police-state tactics, rigged elections,
propaganda, a leftist nightmare.
Venezuela should be a lesson for any place in the world where
socialists/communists promise utopia. Same old lies, same old results.
It's not the socialism that did in Venezuela; it was the incompetence and
corruption.
LMAO.... it is like they are psychic over there.....


Steve is offline now
2019-02-01 16:06:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by PhantomView
Venezuela is going DOWN.
Expect chaos, perhaps a civil war, in the immediate future.
The communist Maduro has absolutely ruined the country. Six-figure
inflation, starvation, aggressive police-state tactics, rigged elections,
propaganda, a leftist nightmare.
Venezuela should be a lesson for any place in the world where
socialists/communists promise utopia. Same old lies, same old results.
It's not the socialism that did in Venezuela; it was the incompetence and
corruption.
Incompetence and corruption is what happens with socialism..
gordo
2019-02-01 18:03:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Fri, 01 Feb 2019 11:06:24 -0500, Steve is offline now
Post by Steve is offline now
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by PhantomView
Venezuela is going DOWN.
Expect chaos, perhaps a civil war, in the immediate future.
The communist Maduro has absolutely ruined the country. Six-figure
inflation, starvation, aggressive police-state tactics, rigged elections,
propaganda, a leftist nightmare.
Venezuela should be a lesson for any place in the world where
socialists/communists promise utopia. Same old lies, same old results.
It's not the socialism that did in Venezuela; it was the incompetence and
corruption.
Incompetence and corruption is what happens with socialism..
Not True Scandinavian countries are doing quite well and Canada is
doing well.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com
Greg Carr
2019-02-01 19:33:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by gordo
On Fri, 01 Feb 2019 11:06:24 -0500, Steve is offline now
Post by Steve is offline now
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by PhantomView
Venezuela is going DOWN.
Expect chaos, perhaps a civil war, in the immediate future.
The communist Maduro has absolutely ruined the country. Six-figure
inflation, starvation, aggressive police-state tactics, rigged elections,
propaganda, a leftist nightmare.
Venezuela should be a lesson for any place in the world where
socialists/communists promise utopia. Same old lies, same old results.
It's not the socialism that did in Venezuela; it was the incompetence and
corruption.
Incompetence and corruption is what happens with socialism..
Not True Scandinavian countries are doing quite well and Canada is
doing well.
---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com
We are not a socialist country. Private companies like Bell, Shaw, Loblaws, Husky, Imperial Oil, Post Media etc. dominate the economy. With the exception of the Kinder-Morgan mistake when is the last time the govt took over a company? As for the Scandanavian countries they unlike Venezuela have a very low corruption rate.
A Moose in Love
2019-02-01 19:40:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Greg Carr
Post by gordo
On Fri, 01 Feb 2019 11:06:24 -0500, Steve is offline now
Post by Steve is offline now
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by PhantomView
Venezuela is going DOWN.
Expect chaos, perhaps a civil war, in the immediate future.
The communist Maduro has absolutely ruined the country. Six-figure
inflation, starvation, aggressive police-state tactics, rigged elections,
propaganda, a leftist nightmare.
Venezuela should be a lesson for any place in the world where
socialists/communists promise utopia. Same old lies, same old results.
It's not the socialism that did in Venezuela; it was the incompetence and
corruption.
Incompetence and corruption is what happens with socialism..
Not True Scandinavian countries are doing quite well and Canada is
doing well.
---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com
We are not a socialist country. Private companies like Bell, Shaw, Loblaws, Husky, Imperial Oil, Post Media etc. dominate the economy. With the exception of the Kinder-Morgan mistake when is the last time the govt took over a company? As for the Scandanavian countries they unlike Venezuela have a very low corruption rate.
many americans think that we are socialists. they have just as many social programs as we do. more or less.
Greg Carr
2019-02-01 23:01:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by A Moose in Love
Post by Greg Carr
Post by gordo
On Fri, 01 Feb 2019 11:06:24 -0500, Steve is offline now
Post by Steve is offline now
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by PhantomView
Venezuela is going DOWN.
Expect chaos, perhaps a civil war, in the immediate future.
The communist Maduro has absolutely ruined the country. Six-figure
inflation, starvation, aggressive police-state tactics, rigged elections,
propaganda, a leftist nightmare.
Venezuela should be a lesson for any place in the world where
socialists/communists promise utopia. Same old lies, same old results.
It's not the socialism that did in Venezuela; it was the incompetence and
corruption.
Incompetence and corruption is what happens with socialism..
Not True Scandinavian countries are doing quite well and Canada is
doing well.
---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com
We are not a socialist country. Private companies like Bell, Shaw, Loblaws, Husky, Imperial Oil, Post Media etc. dominate the economy. With the exception of the Kinder-Morgan mistake when is the last time the govt took over a company? As for the Scandanavian countries they unlike Venezuela have a very low corruption rate.
many americans think that we are socialists. they have just as many social programs as we do. more or less.
We don't have food stamps and only a third of Canadians pay no income tax compared to 47% in the USA. US has lower taxes on beer and gasoline. Our health care system seems to scare the dung out of them.
gordo
2019-02-02 18:29:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Fri, 1 Feb 2019 11:33:44 -0800 (PST), Greg Carr
Post by Greg Carr
Post by gordo
On Fri, 01 Feb 2019 11:06:24 -0500, Steve is offline now
Post by Steve is offline now
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by PhantomView
Venezuela is going DOWN.
Expect chaos, perhaps a civil war, in the immediate future.
The communist Maduro has absolutely ruined the country. Six-figure
inflation, starvation, aggressive police-state tactics, rigged elections,
propaganda, a leftist nightmare.
Venezuela should be a lesson for any place in the world where
socialists/communists promise utopia. Same old lies, same old results.
It's not the socialism that did in Venezuela; it was the incompetence and
corruption.
Incompetence and corruption is what happens with socialism..
Not True Scandinavian countries are doing quite well and Canada is
doing well.
---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com
We are not a socialist country. Private companies like Bell, Shaw, Loblaws, Husky, Imperial Oil, Post Media etc. dominate the economy. With the exception of the Kinder-Morgan mistake when is the last time the govt took over a company? As for the Scandanavian countries they unlike Venezuela have a very low corruption rate.
We just bought a pipeline. LOL
A Moose in Love
2019-02-01 18:19:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by PhantomView
Venezuela is going DOWN.
Expect chaos, perhaps a civil war, in the immediate future.
The communist Maduro has absolutely ruined the country. Six-figure
inflation, starvation, aggressive police-state tactics, rigged elections,
propaganda, a leftist nightmare.
Venezuela should be a lesson for any place in the world where
socialists/communists promise utopia. Same old lies, same old results.
It's not the socialism that did in Venezuela; it was the incompetence and
corruption.
sanctions didn't help. you didn't read the article i posted: 'sanctions of mass destruction.'
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-01 18:54:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by A Moose in Love
Post by M.I.Wakefield
It's not the socialism that did in Venezuela; it was the incompetence
and corruption.
sanctions didn't help. you didn't read the article i posted: 'sanctions
of mass destruction.'
US sanction list ... lots of corrupt people:
https://www.state.gov/e/eb/tfs/spi/venezuela/
Oleg Smirnov
2019-01-31 23:17:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
<http://tinyurl.com/yae2jdep> tv2000.it



"Italy does not recognize Guaido because we are totally against the fact
that a country or a group of third countries can determine the internal
policies of another country. ..". So told Italy's Foreign Affairs Minister
Manlio Di Stefano in an interview this evening to TV 2000 channel ..
"Today the greatest interest we have .. is to avoid a war in Venezuela.
The same mistake that has been made in Libya recognized by everyone today.
We must prevent this from happening in Venezuela."

Looks like there are some sane Italians in Italy.

Greece earlier also said clearly they don't recognize Guaido.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-01 06:32:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
<http://tinyurl.com/ycappyxo> latimes.com

Venezuela's opposition leader says police were sent to intimidate his family
.. police had descended on his home here in the capital, the latest
provocation in the fight for power in this embattled country. .. he told
listeners that a police "special action" unit had arrived at his home in the
capital and was asking for his wife, Fabiana. ..

.. Venezuela .. currently has dueling governments. ..

.. National Assembly - which Maduro's administration calls illegitimate ..

...

Police sometimes knock on my door, about once in a couple of years, - to ask
whether I saw something with regard to the case they investigate or the like.
The last time, our [newly appointed] district police officer visited me in
order to give me his calling card. He was kind and polite, and invited me to
call him if I feel a need for police intervention ;)

The MSM is busy, promoting the bogus idea of 'fight for power' and 'dueling
governments' in Venezuela while the reality doesn't look like there were
dueling governments there. It rather looks like the Maduro government governs
as usual, while Guaido makes bold statemens and gives interviews to American
outlets. Each one is busy with their business.

Actually, Guaido really may be in danger, because there are sincere / ardent
Maduro supporters in Caracas, which may like to offend him on their own in a
rogue way. Another variant may be if CIA desides to stage an assassination
of Guiado in order to blame Maduro for that. So I'd recommend Giuado to take
care of his self and family security, and I'd humbly recommend the Venezuela
government to take a special measures for prevention of provocations against
Guiado that might be then attributed to 'the regime'.

...

The fake news LATimes outlet also misinforms the readers that the Maduro's
administration 'calls illegitimate' the National Assembly. It's not true. I
suspect they call illigetimate the attempts of the National Assembly to go
beyond its legitimate powers, but not the National Assembly as such. You can
read more about the NA-related issues here <http://tinyurl.com/yb7kes89>.

The Venezuelan 'right-wingers' seem to be either maximalist or deliberately
destructive. When they obtained the majority in the parliament, they used
this position not for relevant legislative works, which might be in favor of
the nation, but mainly for attempts to 'overthrow' the legitimate executive
government by 'cavalry attack', which caused corresponding 'counter-attack'.

There seems to be a genuine support for Chavistas among the Venezuelans, and
the opposition should drop the idea that they might ignore them. In turn, the
ruling Left should not ignore argiments from the right, since the latter also
represents a part of the people. I think it's the only way to normalize the
political situation in the nation (and Jesus is love, you know).

Unlawful pro-Atlanticist coup will not normalize it.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-02 00:19:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
<http://tinyurl.com/y84dvma9> moonofalabama.org

To demonize the .. Venezuelan government .., a concerted effort is made to
falsely depict gang violence, and the police reaction to it, as a
confrontation between coup supporting protesters and the Maduro government.

Gang violence in the various slums in Caracas and elsewhere has been a
problem for decades. The phenomenon is by far not exclusive to Venezuela.
The gangs mostly fight each other over territory, but sometimes collide
with the police that tries to keep the violence level down. This violence
has nothing to do with the recently attempted coup ..

Gang violence is a huge problem in Venezuela. Like in other countries it
is a side-effect of rapid urbanization and the uncontrolled growth of new
city quarters or slums. .. The same gang problem exists in Brazil,
Honduras, Colombia and Mexico. In Los Angeles 60% of homicides are gang
related. ..

Criminal gang activity in the slums and the police reaction to it that has
been going on for decades. To now claim that it is somehow related to the
recent coup attempt and anti-Maduro activities is nonsensical. / It is
typical demonization propaganda. As soon as the U.S. government declares
some head of state an 'enemy', U.S. media start to villainize that person.
The same stories that were written about alleged cruelty of Saddam Hussein,
Muhammad Ghaddafi, Kim Jong-Il and Bashar al-Assad will now be recycled ..

...

So far, America is waging a powerful 'psychic attack' on the legitimate
Venezuela government. This approach is consistent with 'democracy' model:
the mass media needs to instigate hysteria, to exaggerate horrors, so that
the cattle-like regular public aka the sheep started to dermand: "'we' need
to do something".

The problem is, it's not a democracy but rather a manipulative techique.
There is a popular delusion that 'democracies' are supposed to be for peace
and they can not be warmongering. It's not really the case. Since your
'democracies' are actually mediacracies, they are subject to manipulation
that develops 'popular demand' for war as well as a tribalist sentiment.
Such techniques were used in the past as well. In particular, the WW1 was
developed this way, eventually leading to the self-undermination of Europe.

Right now, the Venezuela government needs a composure and thick skin in
order to withstand the 'psychic attack' of the evil Atlanticist empire.
They also should think about whom the Americans would start weaponizing in
Venezuela when the insane psychic yelling brings no results. The American
long known method is to mobilize various violent freaks and declare them
'freedom fighters' (or 'moderate rebels'). It was so with the Nazi gangs in
the Ukraine and with the islamic extremists in Libya and Syria. In the case
of Venezuela, it well may be the Americans start giving money and weapons
to the violent gangs discussed above, - in exchanhe for their 'militant
insurgence' against the authorities. The Venezuela government needs to be
somehow prepared for this option.

...

Also I will be not much surprised if something 'chemical' suddenly happens
in Venezuela, - as the recent years have shown, the 'chemical' things are
especially good to develop a hysterical popular demand "to do something".
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-02 00:54:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
<http://tinyurl.com/y84dvma9> moonofalabama.org
To demonize the .. Venezuelan government ..,
Million per cent inflation ...

Three million refugees ...

A currency that has lost 90% of its remaining value seven times in less than
seven years ...

An infant mortality rate that rose 76% between 2012 and 2017 ...

There is no need to demonize; the truth will suffice.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-02 20:04:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Kremlin-funded RT broadcasted live both pro- and anti- demonstrations.





I've made a closer look at the Guiado speech. I don't understand Spanish,
I just looked at the way he's speaking. He seems to try to imitate Obama,
which is itself telling. I think it's a trap. The VE government policies
likely need to be corrected, and they need to find a common ground with
the domestic right wing and mddle class etc, - but not the 'Guiado' way.

By the way, I don't recommend to read Twitter because recently Twitter
removed about 2,000 pro-Maduro accounts, so now only anti-Maduro hamsters
frolic there, and they all look very similar to each other.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-02 22:46:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Kremlin-funded RT broadcasted live both pro- and anti- demonstrations.
Funded ... managed ... operated.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
http://youtu.be/Wce95XiQeuk
http://youtu.be/XgDm57BiKMU
I've made a closer look at the Guiado speech. I don't understand Spanish,
I just looked at the way he's speaking. He seems to try to imitate Obama,
which is itself telling.
Like an adult? Intelligently? Cogently? I can see why these things would
upset you.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
I think it's a trap. The VE government policies likely need to be
corrected ...
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!

Million per cent inflation, 99.99999% per cent drop in the currency, three
million refugees, massive increases in child mortality and starvation, and
you're talking about correction????

You need to get your news from somewhere beside RT, Ollie.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
... and they need to find a common ground with the domestic right wing and
mddle class etc, - but not the 'Guiado' way.
There is not "mddle class"; Maduro has wiped them out.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
By the way, I don't recommend to read Twitter because recently Twitter
removed about 2,000 pro-Maduro
Russian troll
Post by Oleg Smirnov
accounts, so now only anti-Maduro hamsters frolic there, and they all look
very similar to each other.
Your shift started early today? Short day on Saturdays?
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-02 23:11:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
By the way, I don't recommend to read Twitter because recently Twitter
removed about 2,000 pro-Maduro
Russian troll
Here's the sort of thing Ollie doesn't want anyone to look at:

https://twitter.com/ThomasVLinge

Note this one especially, when the Riot Police ignore Maduro's orders, and
walk away from the protesters:

https://twitter.com/ThomasVLinge/status/1091720165333581825


Got a spare room, Ollie? Your may have some Spanish-speaking housemates
soon.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-02 23:17:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Pro-Maduro, and Anti-Maduro

https://twitter.com/ThomasVLinge/status/1091736761351499777

For those not on Twitter ... think Trump vs. Obama inauguration crowds ...
only worse ... much worse.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-02 23:31:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Pro-Maduro, and Anti-Maduro
https://twitter.com/ThomasVLinge/status/1091736761351499777
For those not on Twitter ... think Trump vs. Obama inauguration crowds ...
only worse ... much worse.
Creative photoarts for dimwitted folks.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-03 00:58:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Pro-Maduro, and Anti-Maduro
https://twitter.com/ThomasVLinge/status/1091736761351499777
For those not on Twitter ... think Trump vs. Obama inauguration crowds
... only worse ... much worse.
Creative photoarts for dimwitted folks.
So much butt-hurt.

And such an old version of Outlook Express ...
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-03 01:15:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Pro-Maduro, and Anti-Maduro
https://twitter.com/ThomasVLinge/status/1091736761351499777
For those not on Twitter ... think Trump vs. Obama inauguration crowds
... only worse ... much worse.
Creative photoarts for dimwitted folks.
So much butt-hurt.
Really?
Post by M.I.Wakefield
And such an old version of Outlook Express ...
Because I use a separate virtual machine for the Usenet etc.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-03 01:19:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
So much butt-hurt.
Really?
Yeah ... Sean Spicer was more convincing.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-02 23:45:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
https://twitter.com/ThomasVLinge
Note this one especially, when the Riot Police ignore Maduro's orders, and
https://twitter.com/ThomasVLinge/status/1091720165333581825
It simply means the police didn't have an order to disperse the protesters.
By the way, the Russian police also may be very friendly with the opposition
protesters when they doesn't violate anything. It's a common police tactics.

Here <https://twitter.com/telesurenglish/status/1091780937476640769>
their minister calls "let's not fall for provocations", which indicates that
the government policy is to avoid unnecessary violence.
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Got a spare room, Ollie? Your may have some Spanish-speaking housemates
soon.
Idiot.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-02 23:28:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Kremlin-funded RT broadcasted live both pro- and anti- demonstrations.
Funded ... managed ... operated.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
http://youtu.be/Wce95XiQeuk
http://youtu.be/XgDm57BiKMU
I've made a closer look at the Guiado speech. I don't understand Spanish, I
just looked at the way he's speaking. He seems to try to imitate Obama,
which is itself telling.
Like an adult?
Like someone specially trained for the circus.
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Intelligently? Cogently? I can see why these things would upset you.
Obama is all-around makeup, simulation and falsity.

One progressive guy explained it more specifically:

Chairman Obama .. does make lots of hand gestures, .. those
gestures are carefully calculated, part of the process of
"Ericksonian Hypnosis," a brainwashing technique that works by
distracting the conscious mind while the speaker subliminally
programs the unconscious. <http://tinyurl.com/yco72pn4>
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
I think it's a trap. The VE government policies likely need to be corrected
...
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!
Million per cent inflation, 99.99999% per cent drop in the currency, three
million refugees, massive increases in child mortality and starvation, and
you're talking about correction????
You need to get your news from somewhere beside RT, Ollie.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
... and they need to find a common ground with the domestic right wing and
mddle class etc, - but not the 'Guiado' way.
There is not "mddle class"; Maduro has wiped them out.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
By the way, I don't recommend to read Twitter because recently Twitter
removed about 2,000 pro-Maduro
Russian troll
Post by Oleg Smirnov
accounts, so now only anti-Maduro hamsters frolic there, and they all look
very similar to each other.
Your shift started early today? Short day on Saturdays?
Do not touch my privacy. Maybe in your swampy remote Canada
village it's customary to discuss someone else's private life.
It's considered not a good manner in urban culture.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-03 00:22:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Do not touch my privacy.
Awww ... getting negative feedback from the boss after being outed, Ollie?
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Maybe in your swampy remote Canada village it's customary to discuss
someone else's private life. It's considered not a good manner in urban
culture.
We're not discussing your private life ... we're talking about your public
role as a troll farm serf.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-03 00:32:49 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Do not touch my privacy.
Awww ... getting negative feedback from the boss after being outed, Ollie?
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Maybe in your swampy remote Canada village it's customary to discuss
someone else's private life. It's considered not a good manner in urban
culture.
We're not discussing your private life ... we're talking about your public
role as a troll farm serf.
Speak for your self, Wankie.

You're looking like a dense simpleton here, not me.
Greg Carr
2019-02-03 10:05:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Do not touch my privacy.
Awww ... getting negative feedback from the boss after being outed, Ollie?
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Maybe in your swampy remote Canada village it's customary to discuss
someone else's private life. It's considered not a good manner in urban
culture.
We're not discussing your private life ... we're talking about your public
role as a troll farm serf.
Speak for your self, Wankie.
You're looking like a dense simpleton here, not me.
Actually I think you are the idiot vodka enema boi.
Greg Carr
2019-02-03 10:03:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Kremlin-funded RT broadcasted live both pro- and anti- demonstrations.
Funded ... managed ... operated.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
http://youtu.be/Wce95XiQeuk
http://youtu.be/XgDm57BiKMU
I've made a closer look at the Guiado speech. I don't understand Spanish, I
just looked at the way he's speaking. He seems to try to imitate Obama,
which is itself telling.
Like an adult?
Like someone specially trained for the circus.
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Intelligently? Cogently? I can see why these things would upset you.
Obama is all-around makeup, simulation and falsity.
Chairman Obama .. does make lots of hand gestures, .. those
gestures are carefully calculated, part of the process of
"Ericksonian Hypnosis," a brainwashing technique that works by
distracting the conscious mind while the speaker subliminally
programs the unconscious. <http://tinyurl.com/yco72pn4>
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
I think it's a trap. The VE government policies likely need to be corrected
...
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!
Million per cent inflation, 99.99999% per cent drop in the currency, three
million refugees, massive increases in child mortality and starvation, and
you're talking about correction????
You need to get your news from somewhere beside RT, Ollie.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
... and they need to find a common ground with the domestic right wing and
mddle class etc, - but not the 'Guiado' way.
There is not "mddle class"; Maduro has wiped them out.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
By the way, I don't recommend to read Twitter because recently Twitter
removed about 2,000 pro-Maduro
Russian troll
Post by Oleg Smirnov
accounts, so now only anti-Maduro hamsters frolic there, and they all look
very similar to each other.
Your shift started early today? Short day on Saturdays?
Do not touch my privacy. Maybe in your swampy remote Canada
village it's customary to discuss someone else's private life.
It's considered not a good manner in urban culture.
Why do so many Russians move to Canada when hardly any Canadians move to Russia. We will touch you as much as we want you stupid kulak.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-02 23:22:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
<http://tinyurl.com/y9lgzkdw> hurriyetdailynews.com

Any foreign intervention in Venezuela is "not right" and will deepen
the problem, Turkey's Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu said .. "..
Such foreign interventions are not healthy and not right. They will
not offer a solution. They will deepen the problem. God forbid, the
country [Venezuela] even can be dragged into a civil war," ..
Cavusoglu said the countries should bring dialogue into the forefront
instead of taking sides.

...

This is Turkish comeuppance to Pompeo who cheerled for taking sides.
Byker
2019-02-02 23:29:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
<http://tinyurl.com/y9lgzkdw> hurriyetdailynews.com
God forbid, the country [Venezuela] even can be dragged into a civil war,"
..
DUH

Which is gonna happen anyway. No need to send in troops until after the
smoke clears and the dust settles, which could be years or decades, like
Colombia...
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-03 00:19:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
<http://tinyurl.com/y9lgzkdw> hurriyetdailynews.com
Any foreign intervention in Venezuela is "not right" and will deepen the
problem, Turkey's Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu said
So the guys from Wagner are going to fly back to Moscow?

Wagner is a Russian mercenary supplier ... the guys who tried to take a US
base in Syria (it did not end well for Wagner) ... if you're not up on you
state-sponsored terrorist groups.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-03 00:28:43 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
So the guys from Wagner are going to fly back to Moscow?
Wagner is a Russian mercenary supplier ... the guys who tried to take a US
base in Syria (it did not end well for Wagner) ... if you're not up on you
state-sponsored terrorist groups.
Wagner in Venezuela is a fake news promoted by the Reuters.

I said that in the very beginning of this thread.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-03 08:09:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
One more interesting analisys of the reckless Venezuela affair.

<https://twitter.com/OffGuardian0/status/1091664567845953536>

Hey, maybe it's time to start impeaching Trump instead of Maduro?
Anyway, what most part of the herd of you really needs is circus.
Trump impeachment will certainly be much more entertaining circus.
Greg Carr
2019-02-03 10:08:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
One more interesting analisys of the reckless Venezuela affair.
<https://twitter.com/OffGuardian0/status/1091664567845953536>
Hey, maybe it's time to start impeaching Trump instead of Maduro?
Anyway, what most part of the herd of you really needs is circus.
Trump impeachment will certainly be much more entertaining circus.
Not a single Republican lawmaker and few Democrats are calling for impeachment of Trumpenfuhrer. In Venezuela scores have died screaming for Maduro to be locked up.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-03 12:22:28 UTC
Reply
Permalink
<http://tinyurl.com/ycmmsx94> fair.org

The latest bizarre episode in the Trump presidency is currently playing
out in Venezuela. .. Before any troops are sent anywhere, we should ask
ourselves, who exactly does Trump mean by "the people of Venezuela"? A
recent local poll shows that 86 percent of Venezuelans oppose military
intervention, while 81 percent already disagree with the current US
sanctions. / Nevertheless, it appears that the media have decided that
"the people" want regime change ..

A Washington Post op-ed (1/29/19) declared that we should provide more
support for "the Venezuelan people" .. to "tighten the sanctions" on
Maduro, presenting a picture of the US leading a unified world ..

But in reality, the UN Human Rights Council has formally condemned the
sanctions, noting they "disproportionately affect the poor and most
vulnerable" <http://undocs.org/A/HRC/37/L.34>; it called on all member
states to break them, and even began discussing reparations the US
should pay to Venezuela. A UN rapporteur who visited the country
described Trump's actions as possible "crimes against humanity" (London
Independent, 1/27/19) <http://tinyurl.com/y96ycdpv>. This has not been
reported by the New York Times, Washington Post, CNN or any other US
national media outlet. ..

There has been a great deal of coverage (CNBC, 1/23/19; New York Times,
1/23/19; Fox News, 1/23/19) of the "Venezuelan people" protesting for
Guaido, but very little of the counter-protests in support of the
government .. In a study of over 500 articles over a 16-year period
published this week (Race & Class, 1/25/19), I found that terms like the
"Venezuelan people" or "civil society" were used exclusively to refer to
opposition groups in alignment with (and funded by) the US government.

...

'Tightening sanctions on Maduro' means more troubles for the Venezuelan
economy and so more troubles for the regular Venezuelans. The US actions
have already aggravated difficulties for the people of Venezuela, since
the Venezuelan economy is dependent on trade with the US counterparties
(ot at least it *was* so, before the present mess). And after that, the
bullying US government claims it stands for "the Venezuelan people". And
it makes an ugly show-off sending a "humanitarian aid" ship as if amount
of this aid was meaningful with regard to the 30 million Venezuelans.

It's not nice.

Every usurper of power seeks to speak for 'the people', as well as many
pundits in the media as well as many Internet trolls try to operate with
the 'we' pronoun although nobody authorised them to speak on behalf of
anyone except their personal self. Such powers are transferred through
elections and other legitimate means.

In similar way, your minders mislead you by misrepresenting the reality
so as if 'America' was 'for the people', and 'the people' crave American
patronage. Not the case. Some groups, NGOs, most of which are funded by
the US government or by affiliated / shadow structures, speak this way,
but such groups don't represent 'the people', even if they claim they do.

America has become ugly in many respects, and many nations would seem to
like to stay apart of it, even if they wish normal relations /trade /etc
with the US.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-07 23:34:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
<http://tinyurl.com/y9tbvd8s> moonofalabama.org

Venezuela - U.S. Aid Gambit Fails - War Plans Lack Support

The U.S. is using the pretext of 'delivering humanitarian aid' from
Columbia to Venezuela to undermine the government and to establish a
supply line for further operations. It is another attempt to pull the
military onto the coup plotter's side .. This escalation strategy is
unlikely to work unless some additional provocation is involved. ..

The U.S. government, which actively helps to starve the people of
Yemen into submission, is concerned about Venezuela where so far no
one has died of starvation? ..

The International Red Cross, the Catholic church's aid organization
Caritas and the United Nations rejected U.S. requests to help deliver
the currently planned 'aid' because it is so obviously politicized ..

Unless a large part of the Venezuelan military changes sides, any attempt
to overthrow the Venezuelan government by force is likely doomed to fail.
The U.S. could use its full military might to destroy the Venezuelan
army. .. The a clandestine insertion of a mercenary 'guerrilla' force
into Venezuela is surely possible. Minor supply lines can be established
by secret means. But, as the war on Syria demonstrates, such plans can
not be successful unless the people welcome the anti-government force.

Under the current government most people in Venezuela are still better
off than under the pre-Chavez governments. This lecture
and this thread <https://bit.ly/2RMRSlc>
explain the economic history of Venezuela and the enormous progress that
was made under Chavez and Maduro. The people will not forget that even
when the economic situation will become more difficult. They know who is
pulling the strings behind the Random Guy Guaido who now claims the
presidency. They know well that these rich people are unlikely to better
their plight. ..

...

I already provided <http://tinyurl.com/yb86dum7> economic indicators
that show that Venezuela - even in the present day crisis situation -
remains richer than many of its neigbors. Why don't you pay attention
to them? Why does no one cry about 'mass starvation' in Honduras or
Guatemala, where people are living in much poorer conditions than the
Venezuelans? Your minders don't give a shit about them because laments
about Honduras or Guatemala wouldn't serve their agenda.

As to the American military intervention in Venezuela, I think it won't
end well, and it will rather strengthen the growing negative attitude
towards the US in the world. This negative attitude will grow in any
case, but without the intervention it will grow slower. Mr. Trump is an
immature president, he doesn't know well what he's doing.
Byker
2019-02-08 02:46:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
<http://tinyurl.com/y9tbvd8s> moonofalabama.org
Venezuela - U.S. Aid Gambit Fails - War Plans Lack Support
Beijing was jumping for joy when Maduro was last in China four months ago
but now the PLA leadership is not so excited about the prospect of Venezuela
without him at the helm.

China is Venezuela's biggest creditor and has invested heavily in its oil
industry and regards president as its strongest ally in South America. China
has lent more money to Venezuela, upwards of $60 billion, than it has to any
other country in the world. It's probably been repaid up to two-thirds of
that but that leaves anywhere in the neighborhood of $20-30 billion in what
Venezuela owes China. Analysts say China's leaders are concerned about
whether the deals will be honored if the opposition party takes power but
for now China continues to voice support for Maduro coupled with their usual
veiled threats to the United States.

China's state-controlled TV has shown videos of the protests, but so far
has made no mention of the violence or the suffering of the people. As in
Africa, Chinese influence in South America is expanding fast, especially in
Venezuela.

Besides money, China has also been helping the Maduro regime in another
important way: It's now Venezuela's biggest provider of arms including
weapons for crowd control which have been proving so effective during the
current unrest.

Maybe Charlie Chan is getting paranoid about yet another "client" saying,
"Hey, not so fast":


It'll be fun watching Beijing's reaction when the rest of the turd world
turns its pockets inside out and says, "No tengo dinero.":
https://tinyurl.com/y7n5cfw3
PhantomView
2019-02-08 03:05:05 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Byker
Post by Oleg Smirnov
<http://tinyurl.com/y9tbvd8s> moonofalabama.org
Venezuela - U.S. Aid Gambit Fails - War Plans Lack Support
Beijing was jumping for joy when Maduro was last in China four months ago
but now the PLA leadership is not so excited about the prospect of Venezuela
without him at the helm.
China is Venezuela's biggest creditor and has invested heavily in its oil
industry and regards president as its strongest ally in South America.
Maduro has sworn to finish the Chavez agenda of
running Venezuela into a ditch.

If China wants a return on its investments Maduro
is clearly not the horse they should hook to their
wagon.
Greg Carr
2019-02-08 20:07:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
<http://tinyurl.com/y9tbvd8s> moonofalabama.org
Venezuela - U.S. Aid Gambit Fails - War Plans Lack Support
The U.S. is using the pretext of 'delivering humanitarian aid' from
Columbia to Venezuela to undermine the government and to establish a
supply line for further operations. It is another attempt to pull the
military onto the coup plotter's side .. This escalation strategy is
unlikely to work unless some additional provocation is involved. ..
The U.S. government, which actively helps to starve the people of
Yemen into submission, is concerned about Venezuela where so far no
one has died of starvation? ..
The International Red Cross, the Catholic church's aid organization
Caritas and the United Nations rejected U.S. requests to help deliver
the currently planned 'aid' because it is so obviously politicized ..
Unless a large part of the Venezuelan military changes sides, any attempt
to overthrow the Venezuelan government by force is likely doomed to fail.
The U.S. could use its full military might to destroy the Venezuelan
army. .. The a clandestine insertion of a mercenary 'guerrilla' force
into Venezuela is surely possible. Minor supply lines can be established
by secret means. But, as the war on Syria demonstrates, such plans can
not be successful unless the people welcome the anti-government force.
Under the current government most people in Venezuela are still better
off than under the pre-Chavez governments. This lecture
http://youtu.be/STcepwXxwWA and this thread <https://bit.ly/2RMRSlc>
explain the economic history of Venezuela and the enormous progress that
was made under Chavez and Maduro. The people will not forget that even
when the economic situation will become more difficult. They know who is
pulling the strings behind the Random Guy Guaido who now claims the
presidency. They know well that these rich people are unlikely to better
their plight. ..
...
I already provided <http://tinyurl.com/yb86dum7> economic indicators
that show that Venezuela - even in the present day crisis situation -
remains richer than many of its neigbors. Why don't you pay attention
to them? Why does no one cry about 'mass starvation' in Honduras or
Guatemala, where people are living in much poorer conditions than the
Venezuelans? Your minders don't give a shit about them because laments
about Honduras or Guatemala wouldn't serve their agenda.
As to the American military intervention in Venezuela, I think it won't
end well, and it will rather strengthen the growing negative attitude
towards the US in the world. This negative attitude will grow in any
case, but without the intervention it will grow slower. Mr. Trump is an
immature president, he doesn't know well what he's doing.
The only reason no one is starving to death is because over a million ppl have fled into Columbia. What a great statement for socialism, "No one starving to death in Venezuela". Don't set the bar too high now.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-08 19:35:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
It had been published when The Guardian was not as filthy as it is today.

<http://tinyurl.com/y94xfafc> theguardian.com

Hugo Chavez's 10 years in office have led to better healthcare and
education for the majority of Venezuelans .. "This government has left
the era when governments never did anything for the country. They used to
just help capitalists, which were a minority of the population. This
government actually cares about the education and health of poor people."

<http://tinyurl.com/y8u77x3a> theguardian.com

How did Venezuela change under Hugo Chavez?

. Unemployment has dropped from 14.5% of the total labour force in 1999 to
7.6% in 2009

. Population has increased from 23,867,000 in 1999 to 29,278,000 in 2011.
The annual population growth was 1.5% in 2011 compared with 1.9% in 1999

. GDP per capita has risen from $4,105 to $10,801 in 2011 ..

. Poverty has decreased - in 1999, 23.4% of the population were recorded as
being in extreme poverty, this fell to 8.5% in 2011 ..

. Infant mortality is now lower than in 1999 - from a rate of 20 per 1,000
live births then to a rate of 13 per 1,000 live births in 2011

. Violence has been a key concern in Venezuela for some time ..

...

By the way, the above is more real leftism rather than what you in the US
have been accustomed to call 'the left' by the offstage orchestrators of
your manageable collective psychosis.

They cite there 'violence' as a notable issue. The rise of violence level
is often a companion of urbanization and other changes in the typical way of
life of regular citizens. This way it's a side effect of the improvements in
education, income and other things that drive people to change their customs
and lifestyle. Today, quite many Atlanticist outlets undecently seek to
misrepresent the Venezuelan police actions against such violent groups as a
Maduro's oppression against protesters and political activists.
Rudy Canoza
2019-02-08 19:46:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
[Russian troll's lies snipped]
Venezuela is a basket case due to socialism. Fuck off, shitbag.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-08 19:52:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rudy Canoza
[Russian troll's lies snipped]
Venezuela is a basket case due to socialism. Fuck off, shitbag.
Go away, Swinie, you are intellectually inferior.
Rudy Canoza
2019-02-08 20:27:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
[Russian troll's lies snipped]
Venezuela is a basket case due to socialism.  Fuck off, shitbag.
Go away
Fuck off, lying Putin-paid shitworm troll. The FBI are onto you.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-08 20:31:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Rudy Canoza
Post by Oleg Smirnov
[Russian troll's lies snipped]
Venezuela is a basket case due to socialism. Fuck off, shitbag.
Go away, Swinie, you are intellectually inferior.
Fuck off, lying Putin-paid shitworm troll. The FBI are onto you.
Fuck the FBI.

yawn
Rudy Canoza
2019-02-08 20:45:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by Oleg Smirnov
[Russian troll's lies snipped]
Venezuela is a basket case due to socialism. Fuck off, shitbag.
Go away, Swinie, you are intellectually inferior.
Fuck off, lying Putin-paid shitworm troll.  The FBI are onto you.
Fuck the FBI.
You won't be talking like a tuff-boi when they haul you in to be grilled by
Robert Mueller, Ollie you fucking Putin-paid troll bitch. You'll be
pissing your trusiki.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-08 21:13:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 2/8/2019 12:31 PM, Oleg Smirnov
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by Oleg Smirnov
[Russian troll's lies snipped]
Venezuela is a basket case due to socialism. Fuck off, shitbag.
Go away, Swinie, you are intellectually inferior.
Fuck off, lying Putin-paid shitworm troll. The FBI are onto you.
Fuck the FBI.
You won't be talking like a tuff-boi when they haul you in to be grilled by
Robert Mueller, Ollie you fucking Putin-paid troll bitch. You'll be pissing
your trusiki.
Try to say something non-meaningless.
Rudy Canoza
2019-02-08 22:17:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by Rudy Canoza
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by Rudy Canoza
Post by Oleg Smirnov
[Russian troll's lies snipped]
Venezuela is a basket case due to socialism. Fuck off, shitbag.
Go away, Swinie, you are intellectually inferior.
Fuck off, lying Putin-paid shitworm troll. The FBI are onto you.
Fuck the FBI.
You won't be talking like a tuff-boi when they haul you in to be grilled by
Robert Mueller, Ollie you fucking Putin-paid troll bitch. You'll be
pissing your trusiki.
Try to
You lose, fuckstain.
Greg Carr
2019-02-08 20:24:49 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
It had been published when The Guardian was not as filthy as it is today.
<http://tinyurl.com/y94xfafc> theguardian.com
Hugo Chavez's 10 years in office have led to better healthcare and
education for the majority of Venezuelans .. "This government has left
the era when governments never did anything for the country. They used to
just help capitalists, which were a minority of the population. This
government actually cares about the education and health of poor people."
<http://tinyurl.com/y8u77x3a> theguardian.com
How did Venezuela change under Hugo Chavez?
. Unemployment has dropped from 14.5% of the total labour force in 1999 to
7.6% in 2009
Venezuela stopped reporting their unemployment rate in 2016 for some reason :-) There seems to be a lot of ppl out of work to hold mass rallies and fight the authorities.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
. Population has increased from 23,867,000 in 1999 to 29,278,000 in 2011.
In 2019 it is down to 28.8 million as the country takes a great leap backwards.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
The annual population growth was 1.5% in 2011 compared with 1.9% in 1999
It is estimated 3 million ppl have fled the country to Columbia in order to stay alive in the past 3 years. Ppl are fleeing Honduras and Guatemala and heading to Trumpenfuhrer land not the socialist disaster of Venezuela.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
. GDP per capita has risen from $4,105 to $10,801 in 2011 ..
GDP growth
-6.0% (2015), -16.5% (2016), -14.5% (2017e), -14.3% (2018f)

https://www.google.ca/search?ei=ceNdXNv5FNXl9APJg62YDA&q=what+is+the+GDP+of+Venezuela&oq=what+is+the+GDP+of+Venezuela&gs_l=psy-ab.3..0j0i22i30.192539.204840..205234...13.0..2.83.2790.50......0....1..gws-wiz.....6..0i71j35i39j0i67j0i20i263j0i131.HLRLLDpUuZA
Post by Oleg Smirnov
. Poverty has decreased - in 1999, 23.4% of the population were recorded as
being in extreme poverty, this fell to 8.5% in 2011 ..
Total crap. There are food riots in the street and many store shelves are empty and there is a shortage of medication. 3 million ppl have fled the country in the last few years.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
. Infant mortality is now lower than in 1999 - from a rate of 20 per 1,000
In 2017, the infant mortality rate in Venezuela was at about 26 deaths per 1,000 live births. Notice this info is 2 years old no doubt it has gotten worse.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
live births then to a rate of 13 per 1,000 live births in 2011
. Violence has been a key concern in Venezuela for some time ..
50 ppl dead from the authorities alone as well as all the street crime endemic to that part of the world.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
...
By the way, the above is more real leftism rather than what you in the US
have been accustomed to call 'the left' by the offstage orchestrators of
your manageable collective psychosis.
They cite there 'violence' as a notable issue. The rise of violence level
is often a companion of urbanization and other changes in the typical way of
life of regular citizens. This way it's a side effect of the improvements in
education, income and other things that drive people to change their customs
and lifestyle. Today, quite many Atlanticist outlets undecently seek to
misrepresent the Venezuelan police actions against such violent groups as a
Maduro's oppression against protesters and political activists.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-08 20:55:05 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
How did Venezuela change under Hugo Chavez?
Chavez died six years ago. How are things today?
Post by Oleg Smirnov
. Unemployment has dropped from 14.5% of the total labour force in 1999 to
7.6% in 2009
Venezuela stopped reporting their unemployment statistics in 2016, when the
rate was estimated to be 20.6%. The rate was estimated to be 27.1% in 2017,
and 33.3% in 2018.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
. Population has increased from 23,867,000 in 1999 to 29,278,000 in 2011.
The annual population growth was 1.5% in 2011 compared with 1.9% in 1999
The population in 2019 is estimated to be 31.7 million, with over 3 million
refugees having fled abroad.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
. GDP per capita has risen from $4,105 to $10,801 in 2011 ..
The GDP per capita is projected to drop over 50% between 2015 and 2019.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
. Poverty has decreased - in 1999, 23.4% of the population were recorded as
being in extreme poverty, this fell to 8.5% in 2011 ..
The current poverty rate is estimated to be 87%, with 61% living in extreme
poverty.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
. Infant mortality is now lower than in 1999 - from a rate of 20 per 1,000
live births then to a rate of 13 per 1,000 live births in 2011
Infant mortality is now higher that in 1999, 21.1 per 1000 live births.
Oleg Smirnov
2019-02-08 21:09:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
How did Venezuela change under Hugo Chavez?
. GDP per capita has risen from $4,105 to $10,801 in 2011 ..
The GDP per capita is projected to drop over 50% between 2015 and 2019.
"projected"?

I already gave you the IMF's 2017 number upstream the thread.
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
. Poverty has decreased - in 1999, 23.4% of the population were recorded as
being in extreme poverty, this fell to 8.5% in 2011 ..
The current poverty rate is estimated to be 87%, with 61% living in extreme
poverty.
These numbers are not intended to say that everything there is fine
today, but rather to illustrate the claim that the Chavismo policies
were successful. And many Venezuelans still have good memories of that.
It's contrary to the false idea your minders promote today, that the
Chavismo as such is such an all-around failure and horror.
M.I.Wakefield
2019-02-08 21:45:49 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
How did Venezuela change under Hugo Chavez?
. GDP per capita has risen from $4,105 to $10,801 in 2011 ..
The GDP per capita is projected to drop over 50% between 2015 and 2019.
"projected"?
It's down over 40% from 2015, and nobody credible thinks that it's not going
to keep dropping.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
Post by M.I.Wakefield
Post by Oleg Smirnov
. Poverty has decreased - in 1999, 23.4% of the population were
recorded as being in extreme poverty, this fell to 8.5% in 2011 ..
The current poverty rate is estimated to be 87%, with 61% living in
extreme poverty.
These numbers are not intended to say that everything there is fine today,
but rather to illustrate the claim that the Chavismo policies were
successful.
I have two responses ... pick which one you like better:

- Aside from that Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?

- The RMS Titanic was having a great maiden voyage too, as long as you don't
pay attention to what happened after 11:38 pm on April 14th.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
And many Venezuelans still have good memories of that.
Yeah ... the good old days ... when they had food and medicine.
Post by Oleg Smirnov
It's contrary to the false idea your minders promote today, that the
Chavismo as such is such an all-around failure and horror.
It's pretty much turned out to be an all-around failure and horror.
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